
I was talking to Ralph Claxton last Thursday at my Inner Circle mastermind for February 2007 (that is Ralph and me in the picture above) and he was telling me about his first successful short sale deal that he just got approved and he said, “ I am walking in to a $65,000 equity after some cosmetic repairs” and I said, “ Ralph you still look a little shocked that the bank give you a $65,000 discount” and he said, “ Well I am” and we both burst out laughing.
A similar conversation happened with Rodney in January as he was talking about the $115,000 short sale discount they got a house that only required around $11,000 in cosmetic repairs. Rodney is a pro now when it comes to doing Short Sales in Michigan but darn it $115,000 is still $115,000; it was Dennis first deal so he look liked a lot like Ralph – simply amazed that a fax machine and few pieces of paper can create six figure equity out of thin year.
There is lots of money to be made, equity to be had, with a lots less competition if you know how to “talk” to banks and especially Loss Mitigation Officers at banks who are solely responsible for approving big discounts on Michigan foreclosures. They are the warlords of the Short Sale world in banks. You take the effort to learn how to convince them - you have almost magical powers to create "Equity At Will"
Now a large number of Michigan real state investors mistakenly believe that the Loss Mitigation Officers can became their buddies which frankly speaking is a strange thing to pretend because their job is to minimize the loss that the bank is about to take from your hands.
Your mission, on the other hand, should you choose to accept it, is to whack the bank as hard as possible and “create” as much as equity as possible for yourself.
So when I say the 5 Lies That Banks Tell Michigan Real Estate Investors – I am not joking about it. They are going to get as much money out of you as possible. You on the other hand, armed with the knowledge in this post I am about to give you is going to whack their offense into tiny little pieces and still get your way.
I do want to remind you also before we go into these 5 Lies that banks tell and how to counter them effectively, that my Quick Start 2007 Bootcamp is happening on March 30, 31 and April 1 and I intend to spend the entire Saturday (March 31) –almost 9 hours talking about nothing but Short Sales in Michigan – how to get them in your Michigan city, how to put together a complete short sale package, how to talk to homeowners in foreclosure, how to “convince” banks to give you big discounts, how to flip these houses in Michigan to homeowners and other investors – the whole enchilada is covered from top to bottom with real life case studies and examples taken from my own deals and my Inner Circle members in Michigan in the last 12 months.
I like to teach small groups so I can spend time with each student and that number is almost there right now. If you are serious about buying and selling Michigan bank foreclosures then, do go to the Quick Start 2007 website, and take care of your enrollment right away. There is a very generous, 100% No Risk Enrollment guarantee and a $100 St.Patricks Day Early bird discount for students. Details are here.
Here is my list of Top 5 Lies That Banks Tell Michigan Real Estate Investors To Avoid Giving Big Discounts And How You Can Easily Counter And Conquer These Lies And Actually Turn Them Around To Your Advantage:
Lie #1: “We rather take the home back then to sell it to you at a loss.”
Oh please! Are you kidding me? You mean to me tell me that not getting a mortgage payment for 90 days; paying an attorney firm like Trott and Trott fees to file public Notice of Default in the county court house; paying hefty court fees; and then waiting another 7 months for the homeowner to leave the house and then paying a real estate agent another 6% and paying an asset management firm their fees to manage the liquidation, and even then no guarantee that you will get 100% Fair Market Value for the Michigan foreclosure – the bank is actually excited to take back yet another “Michigan Box” back?
It is not likely that this particular house is the only house that this particular bank is taking back this month. It is also not likely that the next month there will be no more foreclosures in Michigan; there will be a truck full of them, unloading at the gates of this bank and yet the Loss Mitigation officer is telling you calmly that that they rather take this house back then to sell it to you at a loss.
Look they know they are going to lose money doing the Short Sale with you – apart from some really small credit unions or local banks – the big boys of lending world do thousands of these deals every month. You should understand that. I mean I cannot imagine the number of foreclosures hitting Countrywide, Interfirst, Homecomings, Argent, Flagstar, and Citifinancial etc.
This is how I counter this lie;
"Oh come on, Michigan has a six month redemption period – meaning you are not getting your money back for another 8-10 months because of the six month redemption period in Michigan plus your house may get damaged either by the people living there or the harsh weather – why would you want to take this house back where you are about to get couple of dozen just like that in the next week or so? I am a serious buyer – ready to close within 15 days as soon as short sale is approved. I wish I could give you more money but in this market I simply cannot take a higher mortgage in my name”.
Rodney tells me that he actually made an entire collection of “bad news stories” out of Detroit News and Free Press and he actually includes them in every Short Sale package he sends out. Funny or what? For the first time we figured out how to use the negative news about Michigan to our business advantage.
I will teach you another huge lesson here – probably itself worth couple of hundred thousand dollars to if you use it wisely – Loss Mitigation is a regional game – meaning that the loss mitigation case officers can and do get transferred around in the department. We encounter Loss Mitigation officers all the time who were handling Florida or Georgia two weeks ago and now they are managing Michigan files.
Believe it or not they don’t know about the 6-month redemption period in Michigan – they think that all States have 30-day redemption, which is true for some States but not Michigan. So if you notice part of my counter is letting them know in a nice way of reminding them of this little fact. More than one time, the Loss Mitigation officer has come back with a “Huh! What do you mean I am not getting the house back for another six months.”
Knowledge, ladies and gentleman, is power.
Lie #2: “We have other higher offers on this property than what you offer. We need you to come back higher on the price.”
This is a typical voice mail, left on dozens of voice mails on Michigan real estate investors cell phones every day by loss mitigation officers hoping that the suckers or newbies will call back and raise their offers.
Hello! Think about it if I was selling something and there were two people making an offer on it – and the one offer was lower than the other – why would I waste time talking to the lesser of the two? I would call the one who made the highest offer and try to push him to give me more!
My short and to the point response to this lie;
" I understand that you might have a higher offer on this property – I have looked into my own numbers – you know the closing costs, the holding costs, the cost to renovate the property and I cannot offer you more than _________ on this property. Let me know if that works for you.”
Obviously if you know how to calculate your offer correctly to begin with (most of the new investors start between a place of delusion and hope and not reality) then your numbers t than you did started a little lower than what you wanted to buy the property in the first place.
Right?
Please say YES!
This is where you calmly understand that this is your opportunity to raise your price a little to that number, the one you wanted to make the deal happen anyway, make the loss mitigation officer happy that he is getting something more out of you, let him or her gain some face in front of his or her supervisor and yet you are about to pay what you intended to pay from day one.
Half of real estate is dealing with people; half of it is knowing your numbers – you should know both if you want to get some big discounts doing Short Sales in Michigan. I use a simple spreadsheet to calculate my offer numbers that gives me a breathing room from day one to come and counter this lie and win.
Lie #3: “We can discuss your short sale offer once the homeowner has gone current…”
Oh Mamma! Bring the smelling salts out right now if you are even thinking about doing it or you have done this blunder in the past because I am going to pass out. :o)
Going current means that the bank is asking you the pay the late payments on behalf of the homeowner BEFORE they even talk to you. The funny thing is that if you are crazy enough to do this than the bank and the loss mitigation officer has absolutely no incentive to talk to you.
Why would they bother giving you a big fat discount when they just what was owed to them and now they have couple of more months to delay the inevitable? Obviously the homeowner has no money to pay them otherwise the house would not be in foreclosure to begin with so the money is coming out of your account and if you do pay it then you might as well say goodbye to that wire transfer.
There are some real estate investors who like doing this, taking the deed of the house from the homeowner who wants nothing to do with it and then lease optioning it out. They like playing the landlord / rental game and may be if you are doing that then going current might be a good thing depending on that particular deal.
But what I do and my Inner Circle members do is we want to buy houses straight out. We want discounts on the houses; big ones preferably and the "going current" is not the way to go if you are looking to get $115,000 or $65,000 in equity that you just created out of thin year.
The way I handle this lie is
" Unfortunately I cannot go current because I am not interested in reinstating this mortgage loan with you. I am already approved with (put your bank name here unless you are paying cash) and I am interested in buying this home from Mr. Jones as quickly as possible if you approve the short sale, so going current is not a possibility at this point in time for me. However I can close within 15 days once the short sale is approved from you."
Lie #4: “We are looking into fixing this house ourselves.”
Once in a blue moon, a loss mitigation officer will utter these words. I can tell you that this is more of a possibility in high-end expensive real estate markets like California, Arizona, and New England etc than in Michigan. In Michigan I have seen this in high end houses in Bloomfield or Birmingham especially when there was mortgage fraud involved (pretty common in large foreclosures) and the bank is about to get killed taking this loss.
So sometime in high end houses they will try to fix the house and try to sell it retail. Although I stay miles away from high end houses, they are fun to live in but not fun to buy and flip unless you want to sit in them for the next decade in Michigan. :o)
You will not see this lie on the kind of houses I coach my Inner Circle members to do. I mean can you see a loss mitigation officer actually hiring a contractor to go and fix an $115,000 house in Dearborn or Detroit or Pontiac or Fraser or Kalamazoo or Grand Rapids? By the time they are done paying some ridiculously high amount to their contractors they will be in the hole even more.
One exception where this does happens is new construction foreclosures where the builder or the homeowner actually went into foreclosure for some personal reason (divorce, business went down under) during construction and the bank has no option but to grit their teeth and fix the darn thing. I once saw a $2,000,000 foreclosure in Novi – they were half done with putting bricks on the house when they went into foreclosure. The drywall was not done in half of the house. For all purposes it looked like a spec house. In that situation sometimes banks will go the distance just because the losses are so so high and get the house fixed.
Now if a loss mitigation officer did came back & said that to me, on a Short Sale package I sent to them for lets say a $110,000 ranch in Oak Park, Michigan, I will probably laugh and say,
" You are kidding right? You want to fix an $110,000 house and deal with contractors in this weather??? Well that is your decision but if you do change your mind in the meanwhile you do have my cell phone number, give me a call, I am approved and can close in 15 days from the point you say YES to me. I like Oak Park a lot but the house needs some major updates just to let you know to make it marketable in the Michigan market."
Nice, simple, courteous and to the point ands still leaving the door open for future negotiations.
Lie #5: “The BPO on the property is a lot higher than what you are offering.”
That is a pretty common occurrence and I don’t know why so many new real estate investors in Michigan freak out and start thinking about raising their offer prices just because of that.
I mean if you realistically think about it you are asking for a big discount on a Michigan house that typically has nothing wrong with it except paint, carpet, some kitchen updates (new counters / sinks) and minor cosmetic work so it is very possible that the house will come back with a bigger BPO than your offer. On a side note you should not; repeat should not; be doing short sales on Junkers.
So what?
This is how I handle it; actually there are two ways you can answer this, here is one that we use frequently:
" I understand that, but my wife and I do want to update the house since it is very old fashioned from outside, the kitchen and all the bathrooms needs some major updates, not to mention new carpet and paint before we move in and we are only approved for (insert what ever you are offering here) dollars and paying a full market value for a house where I have to spend money to update the house inside and outside is not going to be possible for me right now, however if you can approve the short sale - we are ready to close in 15 days."
When you are negotiating with banks, well anybody for that matter and you are saying NO - it is always a good business practice to offer a carrot with the stick. So if you look at the above script - I am telling them that I do understand that they are about to get a good whupping for giving me the big discount but then I also add sugar on my pill by telling them that I am ready to go and close in 15 days which means that the bank will gets its money, now, faster, then to wait months and then still get a smaller check.
Good negotiating is not about winning; it is about giving and receiving – they get what they want (a speedy closing) you get what you want (a huge fat discount on the mortgage); they have their numbers; you have your numbers – make your peace somewhere you are happy (remember it is your business – theirs is only a job) or move on to the next deal. Ralph has 3 more deals pending – if one of them does not goes his way I can assure you that he will not be sitting in a corner with his head in his hands wondering what he did wrong. He would what I would – count the money and equity I got already and move on to the next Short Sale deal.
Here is a bigger lesson from all this -there are lots of ways to buy foreclosures in Michigan – Short Sales in 2007 is perhaps one of the most profitable ones. Most real estate investors in Michigan are not involved in doing Short Sales right now because they don’t how to do them correctly.







